Casio FZ-1 and HxC Floppy Drive Emulator

HxC Floppy emulator support for all others Keyboards/Samplers...
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undecyclenate
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Re: Casio FZ-1 and HxC Floppy Drive Emulator

Post by undecyclenate » Mon Aug 25, 2014 11:41 pm

Thanks for that, will investigate and report back. I'll first try to crash the HxC program with the file I uploaded earlier.

Jeff
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Re: Casio FZ-1 and HxC Floppy Drive Emulator

Post by Jeff » Wed Aug 27, 2014 12:12 am

undecyclenate wrote:Thanks for that, will investigate and report back. I'll first try to crash the HxC program with the file I uploaded earlier.
Hi,

I have corrected the crash issue into the beta version :
http://hxc2001.com/download/floppy_driv ... t_beta.zip
This was due to the none block aligned file size.

undecyclenate
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Re: Casio FZ-1 and HxC Floppy Drive Emulator

Post by undecyclenate » Wed Aug 27, 2014 2:05 am

That's great Jeff, that was a very quick response.

There may yet be incorrect assumptions in my code. If somebody could try to use the file I uploaded to zippyshare earlier with the new beta code you have provided, then the next test would be to confirm if the file that I provided works with a HxC unit and a further test would be whether it successfully loads to an fz.

If either of those steps fail, I have downloaded your source code and will attempt to build the project. A pointer to some documentation around the build system requirements for your project would enable me to debug any issues around it.

undecyclenate
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Re: Casio FZ-1 and HxC Floppy Drive Emulator

Post by undecyclenate » Wed Aug 27, 2014 4:52 pm

Hi Jeff,
after considering what you did to work around the crash, I've updated my code to make sure it outputs in 1KB blocks.

With these changes I have produced an fzf that doesn't crash the version that swissdoc pointed me to.

It's here, there could still be problems when loading on to the HxC hardware or from there to the FZ - I don't have an easy way to test that, unlike the crash.

http://www53.zippyshare.com/v/53375734/file.html

PS: I updated my code to produce correct values for min/max velocity ranges for bank entries, even though the FZ unit handled the incorrect numbers well.

swissdoc
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Re: Casio FZ-1 and HxC Floppy Drive Emulator

Post by swissdoc » Wed Aug 27, 2014 9:25 pm

I could now convert the fzf to hfe and load fine from SD card into my FZ-20M. There I have 25 Voice with samples but no Bank data. The order is quite random of the voices and the names are having trailing spaces sometimes and characters may differ from the data shown in the index file. I cannot rate if loop data is converted correcly or if envelopes are transfered correctly, since I have no idea what is in the original data.

But the basics are there to start with.
Great job...

undecyclenate
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Re: Casio FZ-1 and HxC Floppy Drive Emulator

Post by undecyclenate » Thu Aug 28, 2014 12:18 am

Hey swissdoc, great job yourself! Thanks for your help taking the time to try out the two files that I posted. I'm real glad the basics are there.

Thanks for pointing out the offset names, it's an issue that wasn't obvious to me because the String class in the library I am using strips leading blanks by default. I should be able to fix it, I can see the issue in FZEDIT so it will be easy for me to test.

The order should basically be alphabetic - if you ignore the spaces. Does that match your experience? If not, I'd love to hear more about it.

I read your post a few pages earlier regarding the LFO on the pitch. One area that may be worth investigating for you is the effects menu where mod wheel, foot controller and aftertouch (which I have only just learned the FZ responds to!) can affect the pitch - it may be that the wrong value is in there, or maybe that's all OK and it's some other issue. At least you have a workaround.

There definitely should be a bank there called "New Bank", so I am surprised by that. Do banks show up correctly for example from fzf -> hfe -> HxC -> FZ:
CASIO FZ SOUND DISK FL-1 - Brass Ensemble.fzf with "Brass Ens 1", "Brass Ens 2" and "Brass Ens 3" ?

I am going to have to investigate this issue with the banks.

In the meantime:

http://reocities.com/sirmidi/fztools.html

This is a good tool if you are curious to investigate and compare the FZV files in the a1_87 folder from the CD1 files you posted before, you can run it under DOSbox if you don't have access to a Windows machine. It's a command line program, but it is less time consuming than loading files to the fz - a usage tip: load the files as FZCom files and use the v button to jump to the "voices" part of the display.

FZEDIT doesn't accept long filenames so I rename files in the MSDOS 8.3 format before using it - e.g. file.ext
You'd be able to see "New Bank" if you rename "hxc_a1_87_3.fzf" to something shorter.

Thanks again!

swissdoc
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Re: Casio FZ-1 and HxC Floppy Drive Emulator

Post by swissdoc » Thu Aug 28, 2014 8:23 am

Will check in more detail if time permits, job and family keep me busy, plus all the toys I have :-)
There was a Bank in, but I was not able to play something from it, could be I was to much in a hurry.
Stay tuned, more to come...

Robber
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Re: Casio FZ-1 and HxC Floppy Drive Emulator

Post by Robber » Fri Aug 29, 2014 2:13 am

Hello Springreveb,
springreverb wrote: you can also get 2 fz's and put hxc in one and floppy in the other , then use the serial bus on the back of the fz's to quickly transfer files across, needs a special cable though, which you have to make up.
, thats what i do, you can also then use the hxc to save anything new that you create on the non hxc floppy, its a good setup i like it
Since I learned that you also use the FZ to FZ port cable I have a question and that is if perhaps you face the same problem as I do? Or recognize anything like this:

I've got this weird thing, when I connect both FZ's (FZ1 with the HxC floppy emulator and FZ10m with an original, still working floppy drive) to each other I get a very annoying humming sound coming from the outputs. Especially from the FZ1. When I disconnect the cable it's gone. Of course I rather leave them connected all the time but when it comes to finishing the track I have to disconnect. Besides that, I think it is not "healthy" to connect and disconnect cables all the time and it is even worse when the FZ's are still operational. But otherwise I have to reload all the time. I also prefer to use the cable to load the FZ10m from the FZ1's Floppy Emulator and for obvious reasons I want the original floppy drive to stay in the FZ10m.

I have my cable wired as shown in the Jeff McClintock pdf file:

http://www.warningwillrobinson.com.au/I ... mation.pdf
Page 8

undecyclenate
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Re: Casio FZ-1 and HxC Floppy Drive Emulator

Post by undecyclenate » Fri Aug 29, 2014 1:20 pm

Similar issue with PC-FZ cable, I couldn't work out what it was for a while.

I too disconnect when it's time to record. The only time I can remember a similar level of noise was when connecting a turntable to a soundblaster input, then once I connected the grounding wire of the turntable to the metal frame of the PC tower the noise was gone. I wonder could some similar issue be at play here.

swissdoc
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Re: Casio FZ-1 and HxC Floppy Drive Emulator

Post by swissdoc » Fri Aug 29, 2014 7:17 pm

In the FZ1 connected to FZ1 via serial cable and both to the mixer scenario with noise you are experiencing a ground loop http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ground_loop_(electricity). For that reason DIN MIDI is using a current loop which drives an opto-coupler at MIDI IN.

In the turntable to soundblaster case you the issue of mismatch from the low level MM output to normal line input and the lack of defined groud on the turntable, where the whole system easily picks up all kind of electrical hum and noise like a radio.

undecyclenate
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Re: Casio FZ-1 and HxC Floppy Drive Emulator

Post by undecyclenate » Fri Sep 05, 2014 2:03 pm

Just to confirm,
When loading an fzf (or an fze), the FZ looks for effect data at byte 960 of the first block, it occupies 24 bytes.
When you rename fzv to fzf, any garbage at byte 960 will be read as if it were effect data. The voice data will occupy bytes 0 - 192.

Even though fzf and fzv have extremely similar layouts, i'm a little surprised it works at all, perhaps when the Casio FZ is loading from disk it doesn't check the file type byte which is the other difference between fzf and fzv.

Robber
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Re: Casio FZ-1 and HxC Floppy Drive Emulator

Post by Robber » Thu Mar 12, 2015 4:44 am

undecyclenate wrote: I too disconnect when it's time to record
Hi Undecyclenate (could only find 'undecylenate acid';-)

I think I solved the problem with the ground loop. I made a little set up with a breadboard, two D-Lock sub 25 connectors, two dip switches, two parallel D-sub cables and some flatcable.
Pic:
IMG_6538.JPG
a total of 15 wires to pin: 1/2gnd/3/5/7/8/9/11/13/15/19/21/22/24/25
IMG_6538.JPG (54.24 KiB) Viewed 6761 times
All is connected according the Jeff McClintock wiring scheme.

Pin number two of the >FZ to FZ< cable is the culprit as one might have expected. It's the ground pin-out. Disconnect this one and the 'hum' is gone.

another pic:
IMG_6542.JPG
IMG_6542.JPG (47.38 KiB) Viewed 6761 times

But there's a but. You can't exchange data between both samplers when the ground pins are not connected. You will get an error if you do. So all what's needed is a single switch to "lift ground" like in a DI box or put a resistor in between. With this set up I'm gonna see what is the best solution.
I think I just will make a neat little box with a nice little switch on top because of the possibility that with a resistor data might be corrupted or time errors will appear and I assume that when I use a switch there definitely will be no humming noise at all. I don't know if this will also work with the FZ to PC cable to get rid of the ground loop. Talking about this, you've got mail.

Jeff
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Re: Casio FZ-1 and HxC Floppy Drive Emulator

Post by Jeff » Thu Mar 12, 2015 8:35 am

Is this ground loop problem already there before the emulator installation ?

Robber
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Re: Casio FZ-1 and HxC Floppy Drive Emulator

Post by Robber » Thu Mar 12, 2015 4:26 pm

Hi Jeff,

I'm not sure but I think the ground loop problem was there all the time, considering Undecyclenate's remark as well, the PC>FZ cable pin 2 connected to pin 25 = ground.
Beside this, I think it was never tried before to connect two FZ's to each other through the port cable, not even by CASIO themselves with their optional CASIO FZ serial port transfercable.
(CASIO, come in please).

Anyway, I installed the emulator approximately a month before I fixed the FZ>FZ cable (thanx to Graham 'gmeredith', moderator of 'Vintage Synth Explorer' for directing me to t/his site containing the proper wiring scheme).
Everything is still working fine. The FZ>FZ cable doesn't affect the emulator and vice versa whatsoever, with the ground pins connected and disconnected.
The original floppydrive doesn't work anymore but in due time, asap, well perhaps today I will check if there is any audible 'hum' between the FZ operating with the original (crippled, it is spinning but doesn't read anymore) floppy and the emulator connected while using the "switchable" FZ>FZ cable (I wish now that I had two FZ samplers extra just to fiddle around without fear of losing one...or two).

Do you think there is a possible danger in lifting ground within the FZ>FZ cable? In almost a year now with both samplers (FZ-10M <> FZ-1) connected with the unmodded FZ>FZ cable and never ever weird behavier occured.
(Sometimes I wish I had two extra FZ samplers just to fiddle around without fear of losing one or both).

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